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Is lying a Thai virtue?
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  1. #1
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    question Is lying a Thai virtue?

    In terms of relationship, the only issue of interest here seems to be the alliance between Farang man and Thai woman. What if it’s Farang girl and a Thai guy? No stories? No experiences to be shared? No help in form of tipps like: “How to be a good Farang girlfriend” or “How to understand him right”?
    Come on guys! I could really need some advice. By the way, have patience, English is not my strongest domain.


    Okay – so I met this guy last year on my first visit to Thailand, in Phuket.

    Imagine 5 swiss girls getting sick and tired of that cold and rainy november weather, having only one goal on their mind: OUT ! where its warm and sunny. We had 2 weeks, friends house at our disposal and no plans besides relaxing and enjoying the climate. Culture? Why bother? None of us felt really attracted before to this foreign mentality. Not until we got there…

    No, I never had a holiday adventure before. Did you ever experienced feeling surprised about yourself? Well I did. I always thought those little brown fellows are somehow a number too small for me (please forgive my way of discribing, I’m just being sincere). I thought that a new myself better. Well…

    Right, the chemistry was there right from the start. We spent all his free time together. We went out dancing, played often pool, visited all those places outside the tourist tracks, watched socker games on big screens posted outside, saw Thai boxing, ate loads of Thai specialities and spent nights on the beach walking, talking, swimming or just laughing about our language barriers.
    No, we didn’t made it (guess I was too damned sceptic about the consequences).

    Yes, I came back home and found out that I was emotionally more than involved. Against all expectations I missed my TeeRuk very much. No, I didn’t write nor call him but I absolutely had to see him again. And yes, 5 months later, in the heat of the moment I booked my flight and there I was back in Phuket…
    No, he wasn’t there anymore.
    Tsunami devastated the nature, took lives, destroyed people’s homes and hopes… wiped out tourists and all the jobs involved whithin that category.
    He had to leave Phuket in search of a job.
    My disappointment reached an unknown to me level. Yes, I met some people I got to know from last year. I was being updated on who is still alive and… well, who is still missing or so… Sometimes I felt like it was too much for me to handle by only listening to all the sad stories. These people sure have a different way of dealing with losses like that. I was astonished about their optimism and confidence due to their religion and beliefs.

    No, I didn’t pack my stuff and go home. Hey, I had 4 weeks to go and I decided to take benefits by learning more about this fascinating country, fascinating people and their fascinating customs, with or without my TeeRuk. I’m aware that Phuket is not the ideal place to start with but for me it’s a start. Yes, I had my excursions all over the island. I talked to many people, asked a lot of questions. Got some strange answers and informations sometimes. All that made me only more curious and “hungry”.

    Yes, I met him again.
    Only 5 days later, just like that, he was standing one evening in front of “my house”. No, I won’t go into details. All I can say, we had a real great time together on the following 4 days. After that he had to leave for home (10-12 hours bus drive) to take care of his sick mother who was lying in hospital.
    Yes, I paid for almost everything while we were together. I assumed, he could hardly afford the bus fare since his continuous struggle with little jobs in that lost place he lived in. No, I didn’t mind spending money on him. Why not? I’m an emancipated girl. I’ve been treated like a lady long enough while going out with europeen guys. Somehow it was fun to change the roles. I had the money, so why not spend it with him, but…
    Well, these thoughts had to come sooner or later, and I begun to doubt on things he told me. I cought him lying all the time and all of a sudden he was like:

    - 38 years old (before: 29)
    - “seperated”/ she living in Bangkok (before: single)
    - having 2 children to take care of (before: free as a wind)
    - never been to army (before: “I was a soldier”)
    - he would like to visit me in Europe (before: I wouldn’t leave Thailand for any reason because I’m so happy here)
    - let’s make a baby (before: of course only safe ### please)
    - mother is very sick and we can’t afford the medicine, it’s like 6000.- Baht (before: I would never even think about taking advantage of you, you are so special)

    I really don’t know how many alarm signs I’ve missed before but now I heard them bells ringing. You know, my English is pretty rudimentary but to communicate with my TeeRuk I had to reduce to the limit. So, first I thought that this might be a lack in understanding each other but all of a sudden everything he said had a “money” word inside.
    Yes, all of this time he still made me feel very special but my doubts were already sprouting.
    He left for home with some money in his pocket telling me, he will be back as soon as his mother gets better.
    I still had less than 3 weeks to go. (Before you get bored I’ll make it as short as possible)
    I was asked to transfer some money to his acount (2000.- Baht, Peanuts&#33 so he could come to Phuket again. No, he never came. Over the phone he only continued to say “Sorry, but neet all mony for sick mama. Love you, need you, miss you….”

    In the meantime I’m back home. Can’t stop thinking about him although my common sense refuses to cooperate but there’s still my heart that….
    My mother used to say – “You can’t command a heart no matter how hard you try”-. Why are all mothers always right in things like these?
    Ok, as I said, I’m home now and back to work. Now and then I get his messages and even (those very expensive) phone calls now and then. “Love you, need you, miss you”…
    Now it’s the amount of 10000. - 20000.- Baht he would have to pay for the “army peper” otherwise he can’t leave Thai “polis catch and put prison”. I’m not making fun of his pronunciation, its just to make sure that you understand what I did.

    My feelings are having a ride: “yes, what the heck” and “no, don’t be a fool, you gonna get hurt!”

    After reading some personal stories in your Forum, I find there’s a parallel likeness in behaviour of Thai girls and Thai boys (at least the one I know). Is this the basic Thai moral? Is the “normal” relationship only a big exception? Is lying a Thai-virtue?
    Some of you visiting this Forum sound pretty acquainted with the “Thai way of life”. Any comments or help concerning my story? What would you say my chances are at this point and circumstances? Am I just another Farang green horn?

    [QUOTE]

  2. #2
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    I'm sorry to hear about your bad experience. While there may be certain times in Thai culture that lying might be considered a "virtue" (ie, to avoid confrontation or hurting feelings)... I think in this case it was more of a "male virtue" at play. Also, this kind of thing is common in many touristed areas of the developing world. You also don't know what his experiences have been in the past, maybe with other foreign tourists... It sucks to feel like you are being taken advantage of, and you have to decide for yourself whether or not to continue this "relationship" with that guy. But no, lying like that would not be considered a thai virtue.


    -mike
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  3. #3
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    After being here for more than ten years i can sadly inform you straight up that your story is NOT exactly a very unique one. If you have a good look throughout the forums here you will come across plenty more stories similar to yours.

    Pls dont blame Thais as a whole just cause you have had a nasty experience with a guy you met on Phuket as that would be same as a naive Farang guy who after getting ripped-off by a girl he met in a bar claims all Thai girls are the same.

    The guy you mentioned in your story reads very like a lot of guys that can be met in Europe, the only difference being 'You wouldnt believe him".

    There are lots of decent Thai guys out there, but you got to live here for a long while to appreciate and understand Thai values etc.. and be able also to differentiate between a guy wanting you for your heart or using you for your money before you are going to have the chance and knowledge to find one well worthy of.

    Good luck next time.
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  4. #4
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    Yes, my best wishes for you too.!

    However, on the lighter side, and with no offense, these instances and our inability to conclude whats happening reminds me much of the theory we used to learn in school : Heisenberg's uncertainity principle..
    Never hit someone below the belt; for you are not the creator.

  5. #5
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    I am almost 20 years married with a Thai woman. In my visits to Thailand in these years I can tell you: never trust a Thai boy! In the family of my wife in Thailand I see it happen every time, that a boy cheating and lying a girl on a way it isn't nice for the girl. OK, in Europe there are boys cheating and lying also, but not in a way as in Thailand. If you go with a Thaiboy on holiday, make it a holiday and don't fall in love with him, only enjoy!
    My wife and me can tell you stories you will not believe it happened!
    Enjoy yourself, and forget this Thai boy.
    Dirk
    "My computer goes down on me more often than my wife"

  6. #6
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    Well when I went to Thailand to meet my internet girlfriend, she lied, that she did not want me for money, but the money situation keep coming up, as I refused to pay any more than a fair share of expenses on any date. When she could not get any money out of me she did not want to know me.
    Well I can say I don't care about her as she was trying to exploit me, but she was unsuccessful, besides the fact I lied to her, I told her I was poor and on a minimal wage job.
    In you situation, I consider you deserve what you got, after treating all those Europe boys as a meal ticket, when going out on a date, It was about time some boy got there own back and made you pay, No one really wants to be the financially exploited on a date, specially a first one, specially when many woman earn more than men, that made me sick hearing about you exploiting those men, not even offering to pay, I consider rude, and if they say no, you should insist on paying half and still go out again, as they only insist on paying so as not to get in your bad books, so as to get a second date, I'm really fed up with European and Thai girls sponging off men, when they got there financial independence more than a generation ago.
    You should be ashamed of your self, doing exactly the same as that Thai boy, the only difference you have done it many times over, now you know how it feels to be exploited just the once.
    Yes Thai people prefer there own nationality as they have more in common, they see a westerner as a free ride, so they lie to get that free ride.
    Having said that, I have met some very good Thai guys, but that type of guy would have nothing to do with a western woman, as they consider western woman to brash.

  7. #7
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    A most unfortunate and painfull experience for you, and I truly hope that you can come to terms with it in a comfortable and balanced manner. Life's experiences can be extremely painfull as well as educational. Seen this way and putting it down to experience you will be better prepared for any future relationships, remembering the signs you chose to ignore on this occassion, and being better prepared should any of them reappear.Also remember that this is not just a Thai
    trait, but one that can occur with any race and within any relationship.
    Use the experience,move on, enlightened, and far better prepared.
    I wish you well, I am sure you will find happiness.
    To be happy with where you are, first be happy with who you are.

  8. #8
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    [QUOTE=[b]Quote[/b] (Lakker7 @ April 30 2005,17:51)]Yes, I paid for almost everything while we were together.
    Well, these thoughts had to come sooner or later, and I begun to doubt on things he told me. I cought him lying all the time and all of a sudden he was like:

    - 38 years old (before: 29)
    - “seperated”/ she living in Bangkok (before: single)
    - having 2 children to take care of (before: free as a wind)
    - never been to army (before: “I was a soldier”)
    - he would like to visit me in Europe (before: I wouldn’t leave Thailand for any reason because I’m so happy here)
    - let’s make a baby (before: of course only safe ### please)
    - mother is very sick and we can’t afford the medicine, it’s like 6000.- Baht (before: I would never even think about taking advantage of you, you are so special)

    Now it’s the amount of 10000. - 20000.- Baht he would have to pay for the “army peper” otherwise he can’t leave Thai “polis catch and put prison”. I’m not making fun of his pronunciation, its just to make sure that you understand what I did.
    Hi there.. sorry to hear about your experience.... all I can say is that normal Asian males have very high self esteem. Normally, we will not accept money from a woman (other than my mother's). Even for Thai men... Bare in mind especially for Thai cos "face" for them is very important. In conclusion, when a man starts lying and starts asking money from u... dump him. Period. Get over him.
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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] (trangam @ May 01 2005,20:26)]However, on the lighter side, and with no offense, these instances and our inability to conclude whats happening reminds me much of the theory we used to learn in school : Heisenberg's uncertainity principle..
    Trangam,

    would you like to reveal more about it? I haven't heard about this theory before and would like to know more the links between this theory with the bad experience of Lakker7.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] (dirk3 @ May 02 2005,17:58)]I am almost 20 years married with a Thai woman. In my visits to Thailand in these years I can tell you: never trust a Thai boy!
    haha... i'll say never (fully) trust ANY boy or girl... especially when money is involved.. i mean when they start asking for money for funny reasons.. just ask paul.. haha

    cheers
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